Another attempt to save Ally Pally
April 22, 2008 — britishgingerIt’s not often one can say they played at a palace when they were growing up, but that’s just what we did.
The pictures below are of Alexandra Palace, where I spent many hours way back when. The Grove - the wooded area that is part of the grounds - was directly across the street from our home, and adjacent to our school. The Grove led through to the Palace, the boating pond, and in those days (the 1960s) a children’s railway that circled the pond. (The pond is visible to the top right of the aerial photo below.) Of all the things to do in London, going on the boats and riding that railway were my favourite pastimes. The palace also introduced roller skating on Saturdays, so our weekends - along with the children’s matinées at the Odeon cinema on Fortis Green Road - were covered.
Playtime, as we called it then, was idyllic.
A year-and-a-half ago, Tanya and I walked through the Grove and around the palace grounds. We stood on the edge of the boating pond after 37 years and could only see remnants of what we remembered. It was a rather dismal, overcast day and we would point to different areas and say, “That used to be….”
The railway was gone, the boat sheds were gone, and there were no children’s boats out on the pond - at least that day. There was, however, a modern and colourful playground, as generic as any other.
The view from the palace is astonishing. Standing on the terrace offers a remarkable viewpoint to see for miles and miles across London, most of the city’s landmarks visible to the naked eye. It’s something I never paid much attention to in 1968!
As for the Grove, it wasn’t quite as lush and expansive as I remembered, and I shook my head at the thought we 8, 9, and 10 year-olds used to play there by ourselves with no adult supervision. Perhaps it was another era, but it was still the City of London in the turbulent 1960s. That week in London more recently, I never did see any children playing alone in the Grove, only a few adults walking dogs or an au pair pushing a pram.
Times had changed.
Here’s the article that describes Mayor Ken Livingstone’s proposal…
From the Muswell Hill Journal, April 16, 2008
LONDON Mayor Ken Livingstone has said he would be “happy” to take beleaguered Alexandra Palace off Haringey Council’s hands - IF he gets re-elected on May 1.
Mr Livingstone exclusively told the Journal that he had offered to take over the running of the Palace from Haringey Council during a brief visit to Muswell Hill last week.
Ken Livingstone: Palace is a huge burden on one borough
His remarks mean there could again be a three-way fisght for the Palace - not promised since a tender for its 125-year lease was offered in 2005.
The Greater London Authority could go head-to-head with millionaire entrepreneur Firoz Kassam, whose company Firoka has spent the last two-and-a-half years trying to thrash out a highly controversial deal with the council for the Palace lease.
The Save Ally Pally campaign group is also in on the bout, having recently unveiled its own bold plans to run both Park and Palace using a new Board of Trustees and investment from several quarters.
Speaking during a pre-election walkabout in Muswell Hill Broadway last Thursday, Mr Livingstone said: “I have said to the council if they want to give up Alexandra Palace, we will take it over. It is a huge burden on one borough. We have taken over Crystal Palace and we would be happy to do the same for Haringey Council.”
Turning to Councillor George Meehan, leader of Haringey Council, who was listening to the conversation, Mr Livingstone said: “If you want to give it to us we will take it over.” He said the Palace was “an impossible burden for a local authority to bear, but it is manageable for the GLA”.
A gleeful Councillor Meehan later told the Journal: “If the Mayor’s offers are serious and he wants to take over the Palace, and he wins the election, I will ring him on May 6 and say, ‘Ken, when can we talk?’
“It would be a great location for a hotel I think, and a restaurant. You can imagine sitting there having a meal and looking right out across London.”
The Save Ally Pally campaign has proposed establishing the People’s Palace Trust in which Wood Green-based Mountview Theatre School could pump £7million into a restoration project.
SAP’s Jacob O’Callaghan said: “I find Ken’s proposal very interesting, and I will be conferring with colleagues about it. We will be trying to talk to both Ken and Boris ourselves soon.”
Although Mr Livingstone did not expand on how he planned to rescue the Palace, he already has experience of taking on large, complex projects, namely Crystal Palace Park.
Mr Livingstone and the London Development Agency took on the south London park’s National Sports Centre as part of its London 2012 Olympics bid, and this year the LDA submitted a masterplan for the entire Park, which unlike its Muswell Hill twin no longer has a Palace.
The 11,000-page masterplan could contain pointers to Mr Livingstone and the LDA’s ideas for Alexandra Palace. Building a cricket pavilion, reinstating the boating lake and building a dinosaur-themed education centre were generally well-received ideas, but most controversially it includes plans to sell off part of the Park for private housing to help balance the books.
This led to residents gathering a 7,000-signature petition in protest - “scarcely acknowledged” by the Mayor, according to John Payne, chairman of the Crystal Palace Community Association.
He said: “Nothing the public has said has made any difference to the masterplan. The consultations have been a sham from day one. His view that selling off parkland for housing, an ‘ends justify the means’ approach, is in our view totally flawed.” The plan is currently being considered by Bromley Council.
FIROZ Kassam’s company Firoka retains the upper hand in the battle for control of Alexandra Palace, as it has a contract in place with Haringey Council.
It is still working with the Palace’s current Trustees on details of a 125-year lease of the Palace, despite being forced to vacate its offices on the site after the High Court ruled last October that the public consultation on the lease was fatally flawed.
The Save Ally Pally campaign claims the current Trustees have lost well over £3million in income due to Firoka’s occupation.
Firoka has not discussed its £55million regeneration proposals for the building since 2006, which then specified a casino - now off the cards - cinema, restored theatre, new ice rink, hotel, office and conference space, gym, restaurant, museum, nightclub, market, recording studio, bowling alley and crèche.
The People’s Palace Trust, proposed by the Save Ally Pally campaign group and outlined at the charity’s last advisory committee meeting, would be a new board of Trustees, democratically elected by Londoners. SAP claims lots of groups are willing to get involved and offer investment, but had “not been encouraged to come forward by the current Trustees”.
The plan is to refurbish the Palace, including the Willis Organ, in a piecemeal fashion, building an “Olympic standard” ice rink and improving the exhibition business.
PPT would raise vital cash from various groups in return for use of space - £7million had been offered by Mountview Theatre School in Wood Green to refurbish the Victorian theatre and use it as a base, and £10million from hotelier Malmaison to set up in the building, for example.
Commercial rents would subsidise peppercorn rents paid by community and charitable interests in other areas of the Palace, fulfilling the PPT’s charitable obligations. SAP’s Martin Hay even says the PPT could bring the entire Palace back into use ahead of Firoka. A separate contractor could be paid to manage the Park itself, he suggested, adding: “This is a tried and tested method and it works.
April 23, 2008 at 6:09 am
In 1968 I was two years old. From a large family who lived just a few roads away from the Palace, in Muswell Hill.
My mum used to let us go to the palace alone from a very early age and I used to go with my brothers as soon as I could walk unaided all the way there and back. We used to go with our black labrador cross dog called bandit who never had a lead or collar in those days and he used to go out on his own. He always took care of us and was always on a level with us kids and our adventures, always able to communicate with us, naturally. We never went on holidays then and spent all our ‘play time’ out in the Palace, in the woods or when it was hot, at Durnsford open air pool which we loved. They closed it down. I remember those years by the music of the time which could always be heard from the radios people had then. I even remember the sound of Chuck Berry singing ‘my Ding a Ling’ live from my back garden, and we all went running up to the Palace to see what was going on. It was an outdoor music festival of all the popular artists of the day. There used to be many bands playing in and around the Palace, rock bands and the brass band on the bandstand that used to be in the Grove not far from the old Pavillion. Yes, I remember those years well and with a tear in my eye. How we played and learned to row really well, so close to the swans and little duck chicks.
I was sad to hear you say that you only saw adults walking their dogs and a few au pairs when you went that day. Yes my dear I have become an adult though at times I am ashamed to admit it and I do still walk the dogs up there. I suppose I would look just like any ordinary adult, but if you had taken a closer look you would have seen it was ‘me’ one of the kids you saw around in the late 1960s or early 1970s. Of course I have traveled and lived in other places over the years but like you have always returned at some point to keep an eye on things. I have had my own children since, moved home back to the area, due to personal circumstances and have been back this past 14 years.
My kids love the Palace just as much as we did but I ‘ve noticed they are not as robust and hardy as we used to be so they give it a miss on dull days but they still love it when it’s sunny. We used to be out there all day and come home starving, but we didn’t care if it was rain or shine. When I tell the kids that I own the Palace with lots of other people who are just like me and that they and their friends are the owners too, they think I am being silly, but thankfully, there are the few who know otherwise.
Things have changed a lot here though we cannot deny it. People are terrified for their kids and sadly this has restricted the freedoms of children and it does effect their general health and wellbeing. Not so many smiling ruddy faces around these days.
Its all turned a bit sour and more recently I have had to give help to the ‘Save Ally Pally’ campaigners because Haringey Council is trying to flogg it off for commercial development and a is currently applying for a permanent gambling licence which I have been able to personally oppose, with 6 others, the Hearing is due to be heard on the 24th of April 2008.
Ken Livingstone and his friends have had eight years to sort something good out for the Palace and so far they have failed to do so, do you know any one else that might be able to help us out here?
Anastasia x
June 20, 2008 at 4:11 pm
A quick update on the Grove - partly due to Ciro’s cafe being open if you go there at school closing time it is awash with little ones rampaging about. The car park is sometimes also used by BMXers and skaters practising their tricks. At weekends families bring their children up for bike lessons and picnics.
It has been great seeing parents gradually let go of their children a little bit more and getting comfortable with leaving them on their own while they drink their chai latte (me included!). So far there have been no major accident, no abductions but lots of very dirty clothes.
The people of London know what’s best for the Peolple’s Palace - let’s hope the powers that be give the Palace back to us so we can get on with the job. I’m sure that with a bit of support, saveallypally can save Ally Pally!